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Post by jhornbr225 on Apr 6, 2017 21:05:15 GMT -5
I also am starting a LattePanda Build. I have the 4GB 64GD EMMC model. My install is going to be slightly different than SNO's. I am not going to place the LattePanda into the Double DIN box because I plan on installing this into my 2007 Honda Accord. If you follow MP3Car.com, user Mickz has a similar car. The Radio and HVAC are all tied together. He went the route of modifying everything and using a microcontroller to control his HVAC so that he could modify his dash to take a 7" screen. You can check it out www.mp3car.com/forum/general/show-off-your-project/160932-surface-pro-out-ainol-minipc-in. That's way more ambitious than I'm willing to be. Instead I'm going to place the PC and screen down in the lower section of the dash, behind the factory door that covers the cubby. If you Google 2003-2007 Honda Accord Dash you'll see what I mean. That way I'll be able to keep the door. There are aftermarket solutions that allow you to install a normal single or double DIN in that cubby, but at the expense of losing the door that covers the cubby. I myself am one for stealth, and I don't want anyone to be able to look in and see the screen or computer. In my older days I would actually install an aftermarket stereo in the stock stereo hole, but move it back deeper in the dash, then I would take the front face off the factory stereo and put it in front of the aftermarket head unit. There was no way to tell there was anything other than a junky factory radio installed. I've had the LattePanda for a little while now. I had some trouble with the LattePanda Screen and capacitive touch screen. The locking lever that holds the little tiny ribbon cable into the plug popped out the first time I tried to use it. LattePanda actually shipped me some of the connectors, and after looking closely at the lever that popped out, I saw that there was no way I was going to be able to re-insert that locking lever. It's in the lower right of this pic. So I de-soldered the original connector and soldered on a new one as LattePanda sent 4 of those connectors to me. I was actually able to solder the new one on there, and If I say so myself, it looked pretty good. But alas, the touchscreen would still not work. I contacted LattaPanda again and they suggested I send it back to them for repair. I took about two months, but I finally got it back, and it works! I was concerned that they would send me a new board, as they repeatedly stated that the boards are difficult/impossible to repair by hand, since they are very small, and the boards are easy to damage with heat. I have no idea what they did, but it's fixed, and so far they have not charged me anything, other than the USPS shipping that I paid to my local Post Office to ship it to them. So I have placed my LattePanda back into the case that a friend of mine 3D printed. www.thingiverse.com/thing:1605660. I put a detailed post over there about the changes I made to the case and the fans and the heatsinks. The LattePanda is designed to be run with a Micro USB 5VDC power supply. I have taken one of the 3pin fan power supply plugs and cut it shorter. You can see it on the left side of this pic. Be careful with the polarity. I found that the 3 pin plugs for sensors for the LattePanda do not follow the same polarity as the fan supply plug I cut off the fan. I powered up the LattePanda with a Raspberry Pi supply, and measured the voltage on the pins on the 3 pin plugs. The LattePanda pins are such that the "-" of the 5VDC supply goes against the outer edge of the board and the "+" for the 5V goes on the center pin. For the fans the Red wire was in the center, but the yellow was on the side of the plug that the "-" needed to be on. I used a small screwdriver and pushed on the retainer tab and removed the wires. I then cut the plug so that it was half the height, as the fans in my case are very close to the board. This made the plug short enough to fit inside my case, but left the metal pins of the plug exposed. I then insulated the wires and re-inserted them in the proper positions. Red in the middle and black to the outer edge of the board. After double checking with an ohmeter that the black was on the outer edge and also had continuity to the ground plane of the board (ie. all the rings around the mounting screws), I powered it up with an old ATX supply's 5V. It worked great. Now the only thing that I have to be careful of is that my fans are 12VDC, and the wires coming out of the case for both the fans and the power for the LattePanda both look the same. I labeled each with it's proper voltage, hopefully to prevent any accidents. I plan on using an Adafruit Trinket Pro to control all the separate power supplies that I plan on using, and to automate the startup process. That's one thing I wish the LattePanda had, is a header to add a separate power switch. I could solder some wires on, as others have done, but I'd rather not. I'm hoping to use a small servo to push the button for me. As the LattePanda only has 3 USB ports ( 2x 2.0 and 1x 3.0), I am going to use a hub. But I plan to cut the red wire in the USB hub's cord and use another buck regulator to power the hub, so as not to draw power through the LattePanda. I'll detail the plan for that in a later post. Another thing I need to learn how to do is post pics.
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Post by flylear45 on Sept 11, 2017 8:07:51 GMT -5
How's the project coming? Any updates for us?
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Post by jhornbr225 on Sept 11, 2017 9:40:29 GMT -5
Not much progress, unfortunately. It's sitting in it's cute little case on my desk. I power it up every once in a while to let it do Windows updates, and to keep any new music I have added to my collection added to it's external hard drive. One such update broke the Wifi. I found some updated drivers, and that seems to have fixed that problem for now.
With all the trouble I've had with the ribbon cables for the screen, I'm hesitant to be dis-connecting and re-connecting those little cables all the time. I have a couple extra center storage boxes for my car that I got at the local Pull-A-Part. I need to make a few mods to them so that the screen will fit and the flip down door will still close. I've got 2 spares, so I can experiment without too much fear. But I do want to make sure that I only mess with those little ribbon cable latches once.
I ordered and received a couple small servos, my intent is to put a little spring on the end of an arm, and use it to press the power button. Now if I only had a 3D printer...
I have found that I need to use 2 GPS pucks, as with 64 Bit Windows there does not seem to be any reliable port splitters. It seemed to work, but Driveline seems to think my location is jumping around quite a bit. I intend to use M$ Streets and Trips for navigation, and when I look at the map with GPS tracking enabled, it seems steady. For some unknown reason Driveline sees the position changing, sometimes 70 miles away, sometimes out in the middle of the ocean.
I have also been customizing the look of Driveline, with much help from COM, SNO and RRay. COM has even added a few small features to DL at my request....very cool.
I'm hoping with cooler weather I'll have a little more time to play at my desk and get the Trinket Pro working like I want. Another thing would be to get aftermarket amps and speakers installed in the car. That way the LattePanda will be feeding audio to something. Right now everything is factory, except for the little adapter I bought on Amazon that simulates a CD changer. It takes a USB stick and plays the music as though the car's factory CD changer is installed, even though I don't have a CD changer. There is also an 1/8" plug for an Aux input, which I could plug into the Behringer UCA202 USB sound card that I use on the Panda. But what's the use of being able to control all my cool music, but have to listen to it through factory speakers? So, I do have some of my music, but knowing what's going to play, and finding particular songs is quite difficult. I've got Albums in folders on the USB stick, and I used COM's "Copy In Order" application to ensure they play in the proper order. The display of the factory stereo only shows "Disk" (which is Folder), and Track number. Not very descriptive.
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Post by SNOtwistR on Sept 11, 2017 9:52:49 GMT -5
You know you can also do the bios mod/update to have the Latte boot up on power on. I went that route after soldering on the power switch wires. I eventually went that route and love the auto start. SNO
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Post by jhornbr225 on Sept 12, 2017 10:23:54 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm aware of it. I just have not had the guts to do it...
But if SNO says it works, then I'll probably give it a shot.
All Hail SNO!
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Post by flylear45 on Sept 12, 2017 10:36:25 GMT -5
Thanks for the detailed sharing. I am carefully considering a single board solution for my next build.
Good luck on your project. I am keeping an eye on you!
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Post by jhornbr225 on Oct 2, 2017 11:41:00 GMT -5
OK, finally getting down to business. First, this is not going to be a fast install. There are things I need to fabricate and program. I had some down time last night, and finally decided to take the car apart to get stuff installed. I've got all the trunk lining out, the back seat, and the back seat side panels. My plan is to put the amplifiers in behind the plastic sides of the rear seat. There is usually a bit of room there that is usually not utilized. I know that it's somewhat of a sealed area, so there is not a great amount of airflow. I don't do SPL competitions, or listen really loud for extended periods, so it should be OK.
I'll be using an older Sony 60W x 2 RMS amp for two Pioneer Subs. I've used this amp for subs in other cars, and it works fine for me. I have a 4 Channel Pioneer Amp, also 60W x 4 RMS, but the problem with it is that it's quite sizable. It fits in the area, but I have a much smaller, newer Sony that is 70W x 4 RMS. I bought it for the wife's car, but then we totaled that, so it's been sitting. It also has a fan in it.
I'll be putting the LattePanda in the front cubby. But to make life easy, I will re-purpose a Pioneer Head unit that I removed from a car I bought for parts. It's pretty new, and has USB and Bluetooth. I tried to get my phone to connect with the LattePanda, and could not get it to connect. I'll mount the Pioneer head unit in the trunk, under the package shelf. Really, it will just be used for volume control and Bluetooth phone. It also accepts a wired remote. So that will be my main way to control volume. Coming out of the Pioneer Head unit there are Front, Rear, and Sub. I will run those to an active crossover to control frequencies and levels, also mounted under the package shelf. I'll leave the amps response flat.
Audio out of the Lattepanda will come from a Behringer UCA202 DAC. It has optical out, so I will couple that to an optical to RCA adapter back by the Pioneer Head Unit. The Behringer will be in the front, as the Directed HD Radio is up there as well, and the audio from that comes into the input of the UCA202. Audio from the Optical to RCA converter will get into the Head Unit via the IP-Bus connection on the back of the head unit. I'll have to assemble and program some sort of microcontroller to send commands to the Pioneer and the PC. I have limited steering wheel controls, basically Volume Up/Down, Track +/-, and a Mode button. I think I can get creative with some short versus long presses of the buttons.
After getting the car all apart, and toying with which amps to use, and how best to mount them, I came up with my first challenge. Speakers. Obviously the factory ones have to go. And I have to be careful as I'll have 70W RMS. I find that none of the speakers that I have laying around from other installs will work. Thank you Honda for putting the lowest profile availability for speakers in any production car. Using Crutchfield for reference, I find that nothing that I currently have will work, and my choices for 70W Power handling are limited. I also thought matching the manufacturer and series between front and rear was probably a good idea. I ended up going with Kicker KSC series. From my experience, people either love them or hate them. We'll see. Those should be here Wednesday.
In the mean time, I can start making brackets for the amps, run the power wire and fuse block for the amps, make some sort of bracket and mount the head unit and the active crossover under the package shelf. I can also run a couple speaker wires from the rear to the front to be able to interface with the factory harness for the front speakers. The rear speakers are easy, straight from the amp to the speakers. I also need to hook up the Pioneer Head unit, make sure it works, and see if I can figure out the wired remote deal. I found some pages online that show what resistances are needed to activate functions, but I don't see the one needed to answer the phone. Time to do more research, or just hook it up and do trial and error.
Lots to do, Lots to do...
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Post by philg on Oct 2, 2017 14:28:53 GMT -5
Following along!
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Post by jhornbr225 on Oct 3, 2017 10:07:10 GMT -5
OK, a pretty disappointing day. I hooked up the Pioneer head unit. It's a little older than I thought it was. it connects to my phone, but only for phone calls. Bluetooth Audio is not supported. That does not bother me, as I do not have a data connection on my phone, so I don't do Pandora. But if the wife is in the car, and if it's a long trip, she might want to listen to something other than what I have on the Hard Drive. Hard to imagine, since it about 60GB, but who knows. Also, to use the phone with the Pioneer, it's a convoluted process, which I think might be OK if the stereo was in the dash. That way you could hit the buttons and read the display. Seeing as the radio will be in the trunk, that will not be easy. For my other car and for the wife's car, which do not have Bluetooth, I bought a couple of these MPOW Bluetooth Adapters: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MJMV0GU/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1They actually work pretty well. If you have some sort of Aux input, either 1/8" jack or RCA, you hook this into it and now you have bluetooth Audio and Phone calls. There is a mic on the unit. The downsides of it are that the mic is on the unit, so you can't stash it under the dash. It has a battery inside that needs charged periodically. Also, it does not turn itself on. You have to hold the "Action" button for three seconds. That's not a huge deal for a long trip, but short trips, it's a pain. I could probably automate that if I take the unit apart and hook the switch to a MOSFET controlled by an Arduino. I could probably also remove the mic from the circuit board and relocate it, so I could stash the thing somewhere, as it's very small. Or maybe someone will see this and help me out. The LattePanda has built in Bluetooth, but for the life of me, I cannot get my phone to connect! I'd love to use the phone and bluetooth stuff in Driveline, but if my phone won't connect to the LattePanda, I don't even know where to start. It's Win10. I go to settings turn on Bluetooth, and try to add a device. The phone can see the LattePanda, but the LattePanda does not see the phone. So I go to the phone and try to pair it, but it fails out. My next option is that I have an older Sony Head Unit. I had a CD/MP3 changer on it years ago. I've got and Aux input adapter for it. It makes the radio see more inputs. Not only does it allow the CD changer, but 2 AUX inputs via RCA, and a USB input. When plugged into a computer, the computer sees a pair of Generic USB speakers. The CD changer is long gone, I wore that thing out. I actually am using one of those with that Bluetooth adapter in the other car. I don't drive it much, and the CD Changer in it started skipping. So I took out the CD changer, put in one of those Aux input adapters, plugged the MPOW into AUX 1 with a headphone to RCA adapter cable, and set the radio to AUX 1. Every time I get in the car, I open the center console and push the button on the MPOW to turn it on. I then play music that I have stored locally on my phone's SD card. I have the wired remote for the Sony as well. And since I would really only be using it for volume, the resistor values would be easy to get. Actually, I plugged the Sony wired remote into the Pioneer, and it mostly worked. Just not the phone stuff. I checked my service manual for the Accord, and found the schematic for the steering wheel buttons. They use a resistive ladder. it should be easy to read those voltages into an Arduino, and spit out the proper signals to the Sony head unit. I posted in the Support Section for Driveline. If I can get Driveline to listen to Keyboard inputs to change songs and to switch to HD Radio, then I could hook up the Arduino as a HID device plugged into a USB port. I could use the "Track+/-" on my steering wheel to change tracks. I could also use the "Mode" button on my steering wheel to change to HD Radio. I would then use some of the physical outputs of the Arduino to send the signals to the Sony for Volume+/-. I'm going to need a strong 5V supply. I am going to order the parts to build a 5V 5A switching supply ala Mickz. I could use an M2-ATX that I have laying around, but I think that the one Mickz described will have less noise. SNO suggested that I change the BIOS on the LattePanda so that it will boot every time power is applied. I have not had the guts to do that yet. My concern with that is, how do I do a clean shutdown, automatically? I'm not really looking forward to soldering onto the switch like he did. Regardless, I need to quit procrastinating and get those amps installed. Here are the Amps. As you can see, the Pioneer in the center is quite large. The silver Sony on the left is for the Subs 60Wx2 RMS. The Black Sony on the right is 70Wx4 RMS. Hard to believe that Pioneer in the middle is 60Wx4 RMS. Here is the active crossover I use. I like that you can feed it one set of RCA's and get three sets out, Front, Rear, and Sub. Or you can feed it 3 sets of RCA inputs. I had a different one that looked more like an equalizer, but I found that the Sub out from that one was directly tied to the rear outputs. So if you wanted to cut the frequencies going to your rear speakers to protect them, you were also cutting the Sub's frequencies. STOOPID. Here is where I'll install the Sub Amp. Driver Side, behind the rear seat armrest. It's deeper that it looks in the pic.
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Post by jhornbr225 on Oct 3, 2017 10:15:28 GMT -5
Here is where the 4 Channel Amp will live. Not that it really matters, but since it has a fan, I thought I'd keep it away from the gas fill area. Here is the Antenna Amplifier, up on the Driver Side C Pillar. Thank you Honda for powering it up every time the factory radio is turned on. The white plug on the left side is 12V whenever the Factory radio is on, whether you are listening to the Radio or a CD. I can grab that, run it through a resistor to an 2N2222 NPN and use it to trigger a relay. I'll be able to use the factory radio power button to turn on my system! This is under the rear package shelf. I plan to install the Sony Head Unit and the Active crossover on a bracket between that speaker on the left and the key cylinder that releases the rear seats there on the right. The only thing I'm worried about there is that I should probably install the new speaker first, just to be sure there is no interference. That black bracket next to the speaker must be some sort of vibration dampener. It's literally a metal bracket with some rubber attached to it.
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Post by jhornbr225 on Oct 3, 2017 10:29:27 GMT -5
Here is the stock speaker. We all know that they put the cheapest, lightest thing they can find in there. Crutchfield says the max mounting height is 0.633". I'm not exactly from where they measure that from, but most aftermarket speakers exceed that height. Underneath that speaker. A First question that comes to mind is "Where's the Beef?" I drew up a little plan to keep me on track. We'll see if it's visible. Time to start ordering some parts to build a Switching power supply. Anybody interested in a 5V 5A power supply? Ala Mickz www.mp3car.com/forum/general/show-off-your-project/160932-surface-pro-out-ainol-minipc-inI was going to get enough parts to build several.
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Post by jhornbr225 on Oct 3, 2017 21:21:41 GMT -5
Well, I got started late due to the fact I got parts ordered for the switching power supplies. And then a friend of mine called.
We put a new Single DIN Sony stereo in his car a week or so ago. After messing with it for the evening, after it was installed, I came to the conclusion that I didn't like it. The menus were too cryptic, the buttons were too small and poorly labeled. Functions that I would use all the time took several button presses. The display seemed intent on telling you what source you were listening to, instead of showing the clock. There were many options for sources, Pandora, Bluetooth, and a few more, that he will never use. He still uses a slider phone, slightly better than a flip phone. There was no way to disable those sources. I looked at the Pioneer models, and they looked about the same. So I suggested Double DIN, you get a bigger display, bigger buttons, etc. Well the most affordable Sony Double DIN WX-850BT, has a huge display, and no clock. It has a ton of dead space on the display, and there appears to be some level indicators that bounce to the music. To be honest, the display looks just like the Single DIN, just a little larger. So I talked him into Pioneer FH-X731BT. The display looks much better, and you have several options for showing the clock, as essentially there are 2 lines of information. And, if there are sources you won't use, you can disable them so that they won't show when you hit source. I understand that the market is headed in a direction where everyone has their nose in their phone the whole time, but you should not need an app on your phone to run your car stereo! I'll be installing the Pioneer Friday. Unfortunately his car has to come all the way apart to get the stereo out, the entire center console, glove box, both covers under each side of the dash. Five large plastic interior panels.
End of rant.
I did learn a couple things today. I like to drop rubber grommets, and then not be able to find them. I lost 2. I even blew around with compressed air....nothing. Also, 2007 Honda Accords have almost no grommets going through the firewall. I found 1, and it was in the middle of the car. It comes out behind the heater. And I thought I was smart, buying this nice, oxygen free, 4 AWG welding cable to power my amps. It appears to be really nice wire, flexible, heavy, nice copper. Not that copper plated aluminium garbage. And the price on Amazon was pretty good, comparatively. The stuff is so...I don't want to say sticky, but it does not pull or feed through the car at all. It's pretty much a two person job. One to push a little slack, and the other person to pull the slack up. It does not slide at all. Then I stated making the bracket for the 4 channel amp. I found that the screws I have are too short. So, off to the Nut House again tomorrow.
Speakers will be here tomorrow. Also I believe most of the parts for the switching power supplies. Gotta Love Arrow, prices are pretty good, and free overnight shipping over $20. Unfortunately, I ordered the stripboards from Amazon, and they are not Prime. So they will take a little while. I suppose I can come up with a temporary solution in the meantime. I've got a M2-ATX sitting around, as well as a few Buck converters.
Oh well, tomorrow's another day!
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Post by SNOtwistR on Oct 3, 2017 21:40:23 GMT -5
You can get something called cable lube at home depot SNO
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Post by jhornbr225 on Oct 3, 2017 21:42:58 GMT -5
That would be awesome, if the cable was going to be stashed away in conduit it's whole life. But I'd rather not have that mess in the car!
Good idea though!
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Post by flylear45 on Oct 5, 2017 4:36:06 GMT -5
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